Northern Song Dynasty Justice

Chapter 533
After comforting Chen Guang's family, Chen Qi whispered to Su Zhe, "Procurator Su, do you want to discuss this matter with the imperial court?"

Su Zhe was taken aback for a moment, and couldn't help asking: "Why do you need to discuss with the imperial court?"

Chen Qi said: "This case does not seem to be a big one, but as Chen Guang said, there are quite a few people and government agencies involved. Besides, the way the imperial court will try it may get out of hand."

Su Zhe pondered for a while, and said: "Although what you said is reasonable, our procuratorate and the imperial court perform their own duties, and there is no distinction between upper and lower. Now this case should be in charge of our procuratorate. File a lawsuit with the imperial court, and only then will the imperial court be able to intervene. If we go to the imperial court to discuss it now, it will be tantamount to being under the control of the imperial court, which is even more against the rules."

Chen Qi just nodded slightly, what Su Zhe said did not seem to refer to the same thing as what he was worried about.

Su Zhe also knew what he was thinking, so he said again: "The most subtle thing about this public prosecutor's law is that the three do not belong to each other and check and balance each other, so the responsibility is shared with each other. Even if you want to offend someone, the other party doesn't know what to blame. It's up to who. If we act together, it will make us all hamstrung and self-defeating."

These words moved Chen Qi, they check and balance each other, and this responsibility can also be passed on to each other.

"also!"

Su Zhe continued: "You just said that Chen Guang came here to ask how to go to the imperial court to file a complaint. It can be seen that the people in Hezhong Mansion only have the imperial court and not our procuratorate. In the future, the people will only recognize the imperial court, which will also force our procuratorate and the police station to submit to the imperial court, and the checks and balances between each other will also be broken. Our procuratorate should do something so that the people can understand our entire public security law. .”

He is very clear about what his authority is. When he was in the capital's procuratorate, he just stared at the imperial court and the police station, as well as the tax department.

After the Suizhou case, he became more wary of the imperial court, and he also suspected that the military imperial court had other purposes.

In fact, Zhao Xu reused Wang Anshi's reform, and the group of people headed by Sima Guang felt suspicious, because Wang Anshi's reform was finance. In a hurry to make money, why?
Building a palace is unlikely. Zhao Xu paid such a high political price just to build a palace.

It can only be prepared for war.

Su Zhe was also deeply worried about this. The key point was that he believed that Zhang Fei had too much power. He not only had the right to precedent, but also the right to judicial interpretation.

If you don't look at it a little bit, this imperial court will not go to heaven!

If the procuratorate wants to supervise the imperial court, it must have the authority to match the imperial court. If the difference between the two is too large, it will be difficult for the procuratorate to check and balance the imperial court.

At this time, Zhao Xu, who was in Bianjing, did not know the final verdict, but he had received a letter from Zhang Fei, who learned that the government used finances to make things difficult for the public prosecutor, and that the Hezhong government ordered the review of Erbi's official documents, hindering the construction of the public prosecutor's law. A key meeting was called immediately.

"Since the public security law must be independent of the government, the finance should not be handed over to the local government. Otherwise, the public security law will also be checked and balanced by the government."

Fu Bi said with a little worry.

Wen Yanbo said: "However, if the public security, procuratorate and law are allowed to directly intervene in finances, the government will be weak again, and it will be difficult for the two to check and balance each other."

Fu Bi nodded and said, "That's true."

Wang Anshi said: "Since this is the case, it is better for the internal treasury to be directly responsible for the finances of the public security bureau."

"How is this possible?"

Sima Guang immediately objected: "The Public Prosecution Law governs the country's judiciary, and it is subordinate to the Criminal Court, the Ministry of Criminal Justice, and the Dali Temple. If the finances are in charge of the internal treasury, there is no reason to speak of it, and the national system will be in chaos."

Fu Bi hurriedly said: "Scholar Sima's words are reasonable, this is indeed against the imperial court system."

The public security law can be directly responsible to the emperor. After all, the emperor is the supreme leader, but if the public security law is financed by the emperor's internal treasury, then the judiciary is tantamount to the emperor's private ownership. These prime ministers will definitely not agree. This is completely destroying the national system .

Zhao Xu remained silent, "Then what do you all think should be done?"

Sima Guang pondered for a while, and said: "Actually, the expenditure of the imperial court and the procuratorate is not a lot, and the central government can be directly responsible for it. The expenditure from the tax paid to the central government is included in the financial expenditure of the court of justice, the Ministry of punishment, and Dali Temple.

Among them, the police station spends the most. The finance of the police station is still handed over to the local government, which can also reduce the burden on the national treasury. Now in Bianjing, many decrees of Kaifeng government also need the cooperation of the police station. "

Wen Yanbo nodded and said, "I think the arrangement of Bachelor Sima is more reasonable."

Wang Anshi and the others did not object either.

Zhao Xu said: "This matter will be handled by the Third Division, the Privy Council, and the Trial Court."

Why should the Privy Council participate? First of all, part of the police department's finances is included in the army.Secondly, Chen Shengzhi, the privy envoy, currently serves as the chief of the Department of Regulations of the Second Government, so Wang Anshi can also take part in it.

"My minister obeys."

Zhao Xu asked again: "About Er Bi's official document, what do you think should be done?"

Sima Guangdao: "About Erbi, I think the court should be very cautious, because Erbi will inevitably increase the burden on the government, and before the public security law is mature, the court should still have restrictions on Erbi.

The minister suggested that the Chashiren and the Erbi be counted separately, and the official documents of the Chashiren should still be in charge of the local government. After all, many people are illiterate, so they have to find someone to write the pleadings.

At the same time, the authority of the local government to issue Erbi official documents was withdrawn. If one wanted to obtain the official documents, one had to come to Bianjing to take the exam, and this aspect could be handed over to the Ministry of Punishment and the Legal Academy.

In addition, the imperial court can also specify in the official documents where Erbi can conduct litigation. In places where there is no public security law, I think it should not be easily changed, lest the local government be difficult to deal with. "

His suggestion was immediately supported by all the political advisers.

Although they support the public prosecutor's law, they are quite cautious about Erbi. They have seen the ability of those big Erbi. If officials are not capable in this area, they will be completely influenced by Erbi, which will affect the authority of the government. , and according to their understanding, there are many officials who are not capable in this area.

Zhao Xu didn't think too much about it, seeing that they all agreed, so he agreed.

After the meeting was over, after Fu Bi, Wen Yanbo, and Lu Gong left with them, Wang Anshi suddenly grabbed Sima Guang and said, "Sima Junshi, we meet every day, why don't we speak face to face if we have something to say, and have to write a letter?" For me, if people find out, they must think we are plotting something."

"I bother!"

Immediately Sima Guang raised his hand and broke free, "I wrote to you because I didn't want to quarrel with you. If you don't modify the young crop law, I will never let you succeed."

Wang Anshi said with a smile: "Sima Junshi, when we were talking about usury, you also hated it. Now I want to reform and stop usury, but you want to oppose it. What's the reason?"

Sima Guang smiled, "Are you trying to stop usury, or are you lending usury? This young crop law came from the separatist regime at the end of the Tang Dynasty. It was just to make money. You have the nerve to ask me why?"

Wang Anshi immediately said: "My young crops are very different from those at the end of Tang Dynasty. Nowadays, those landlords charge at least double the interest, but I suggest that the imperial court only charge [-]% interest. Isn't this a blessing for the people of the world? "

Sima Guang said with a look of surprise: "You charge interest, then this is a business, and you still say that it will benefit the people, what kind of shame are you doing! The liquidation method is the one that really benefits the people and thinks about the people.

Also, you should also know that the forced family ruin of those common people is not all caused by the double interest rate. manage? "

Wang Anshi said: "If you want to borrow money from the imperial court, you need to find someone to guarantee it, so you can be sure that nothing will go wrong."

Sima Guang was waiting here, and immediately said: "The government is safe, but what about the common people? Who would be willing to guarantee loans for others, and it will inevitably become the case. The government will force people to guarantee, and even use this to exploit those superiors Hu, this is even more terrifying than that Yaqian officer."

Wang Anshi laughed angrily, "You are simply making trouble for no reason, so I can also say that there are many disadvantages in the public prosecutor's law. If the chief judge, the chief prosecutor, and the superintendent of police work hand in hand, it will inevitably lead to the corruption of the law and discipline, and even evade the government. You can't use some corrupt officials to judge whether this law is good or bad."

Sima Guang snorted and said, "You're the one who argues against the truth. The purpose of the judicial reform is to make the judiciary more fair. Officials will naturally be afraid of this. And your method is to collect money. Officials will also focus on collecting money, regardless of the life and death of the people. .”

Wang Anshi said: "You are overgeneralizing. My approach is to achieve the best of both worlds. While benefiting the country, it can also reduce the burden on the people and avoid land annexation. Most of the extinct households today are taken by usury. If it is forced, if things go on like this, there will be turmoil in this country, and it has to be changed."

Sima Guang said: "But have you ever thought that the government can still mediate and stop private usury, but if the government lends money, who will supervise it? You said it is [-]%, and if the loan is doubled next time, what will you do?"

Wang Anshi said: "Then I will punish severely."

Sima Guang said: "Do you still remember that Wang Hong, the reason why the court leniented him in the first place was because he could collect taxes? If those officials could amass huge wealth for the court, I still don't believe you would go Severe punishment, even if you want to punish severely, I'm afraid other people will say, we must put the overall situation first, the money is spent, who has the nerve to punish those who collect money for the court.

This kind of thing had already happened during the time of Emperor Wu of the Han Dynasty. Emperor Wu of the Han knew that those officials used various methods to exploit the people and collect money for the court, but he turned a blind eye to it. "

Faced with Sima Guang's questioning, Wang Anshi just smiled slightly, "You study history books every day, regardless of reality, so that you always look forward and backward in doing things, and fear the head and the tail. I am not Sang Hongyang, and the official is not Emperor Wu of the Han Dynasty. How can I generalize? This method has been implemented locally and has achieved very good results, but you are questioning me with a history book, which is simply ridiculous."

Sima Guang said: "In terms of experience in governing states and counties, I am not as good as you. But the world is bustling, and it is all for the benefit of the world. This is an eternal truth. Using history as a mirror, you can know the rise and fall. This is the most reasonable saying. It’s simply fantastic for you to use the laws of one county to govern the affairs of the whole country.”

Wang Anshi also started to take the lead, angrily said: "That's better than you sitting and waiting for death! If you are capable, you should come up with a way to stop this usury. You can't come up with a way, but you don't allow others to abolish the bad government. What's the use."

"What did you say?"

Sima Guang stared angrily.

"Farewell!"

Wang Anshi waved his sleeves and left.

Sima Guang was so angry that he gritted his teeth and bowed his head.

"If you know how to listen to advice, then you won't be Wang Jiefu."

Wen Yanbo came over suddenly.

Sima Guang glanced at him and sighed, "If Zhang San wasn't taken into consideration, I really don't want to stay in this court."

Wen Yanbo said: "Since Zhang San is taken into consideration, Zhang San should be allowed to play a role."

Sima Guang was taken aback for a moment, and asked, "What did Duke Wen say?"

Wen Yanbo said: "The reason why many people still support the public prosecutor's law is that they hope that the public prosecutor's law can check and balance the new law. If we can't stop the young crop law, then let Zhang San block it."

Sima Guang asked: "What Duke Wen means is to let the young crop method be tried in Hezhong Mansion first."

Wen Yanbo nodded.

Sima Guang worried: "But now Zhang San's life in Hezhong Mansion is not easy, so we shouldn't cause him any more trouble!"

Wen Yanbo said: "Nowadays, many ministers are opposed to this young crop law. Even Chen Shengzhi is silent about it. If the public security law can play a role, it will definitely win more people's support."

Sima Guangzhen was like what Wang Anshi said, looking forward and backward in everything, pondering a little, and said: "There is no rush now, the Department of Establishing the Second Mansion Regulations has not yet been officially promulgated, I will write a letter to Zhang San first, and see if he can handle it." .”

(End of this chapter)